Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:00:00]:
Welcome advocates to another episode of the Leading Equity podcast. A podcast that focuses on supporting educators with the tools and resources necessary to ensure equity at their schools. Today's special guest is Rob Barnett. So without further ado, Rob, thank you so much for joining us today.

Rob Barnett [00:00:17]:
Thank you, Sheldon. It's a pleasure to be here.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:00:19]:
Pleasure's all mine. I'm excited about today's topic. I before we even hit record, I was like, I wanna know what does the modern classroom look like? How do we create a single lesson? So we're gonna get all into that. But before we do that, I'd love for you to share a little bit about yourself and what you currently do.

Rob Barnett [00:00:36]:
Absolutely. My name is Rob. First thing to know about me, I think, is that I'm a former teacher. I was mostly a high school math teacher here in Washington DC where I am now, but I've also taught in private schools in the US and abroad. Little bit of middle school and university level teaching and some elective courses too. So everything I will share today comes from my experience as a teacher. I'm also a parent. I have 2 sons.

Rob Barnett [00:01:00]:
It's been really interesting to me to see education from that side and, of course, makes me feel more invested in creating learning experiences that that really work. I'm the cofounder of the Modern Classrooms Project. We've trained almost a 100000 teachers all over the world to build classrooms that are more responsive to their learners' needs. And, actually, very soon, February 5th, I've got a book coming out called Meet Every Learner's Needs, and I'm hoping to share with you today and with your listeners some of the some of the insights from that book. So thanks for having me.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:01:33]:
Alright. Well, congrats on the new book. Folks, there's links in the show notes for you as well, so make sure you grab yourself a copy of The Modern Classroom book. And let's get into it because I'm curious. What what does that mean? It's 2025. So tell us a little bit. What what does a modern classroom look like?

Rob Barnett [00:01:49]:
Yeah. Happy to share. I mean, I think the easiest way to explain is just to tell you about my journey as a teacher. When I started teaching at at Eastern High School in Washington DC, I taught the way I was trained to teach. I stood up at the board. I delivered a lesson every day to all of my students, at least those who happened to be in class that day. And I realized pretty quickly that it wasn't giving my students what they needed. Some students, they already understood it.

Rob Barnett [00:02:15]:
They were advanced. They were bored. A lot of my students, they were they were below proficient on their test. They had gaps in their learning. They couldn't understand it. They were lost. And some of my students weren't there at all. We really struggled with chronic absenteeism, and this is even before COVID.

Rob Barnett [00:02:30]:
It's a bigger issue now. So what I did is I realized me giving one lesson every day to all my students, it's not gonna work. I started recording my lessons on video. Very simple. I would really just, like, start a video call with myself, hit record, explain something, take 5 minutes, 10 minutes to explain it. Now my students can watch this anytime, anywhere. They can rewatch. They can pause if they're in class to ask me questions.

Rob Barnett [00:02:56]:
And it meant that I spent my time in class, not standing at the board trying to control behavior, but I sat down with my students. I got to know them. I built relationships with them. I was more of a tutor, coach, mentor than what you think of as a teacher, and I love that. That's why I went into teaching, right, just to get to know and get to support young people. My my students, they would watch my videos, 5, 10 minutes, pretty short, and then they'd work together with their classmates. And so the class felt almost like a college library. Some students on computers learning, some students working together, some working with me.

Rob Barnett [00:03:32]:
Everyone focused, challenged, supported. Last thing I'll say is that and it is actually the best part about a modern classroom is that when you have students learning at their own paces like this from video, you can actually make sure they understand lesson 1 before they go on to lesson 2. So often in teaching, we say, well, here's the lesson. I hope you got it. If not, too bad. We're moving to the next thing, and that just sets students up to fail. They lose confidence in themselves. They have gaps in their learning.

Rob Barnett [00:03:59]:
In math, that was such a problem, but it's true in every subject. You really should understand one skill before you move to the next. So in a modern classroom, it's all about mastery. I sit down with the student. If they understand it, move on. If not, let me help you get it. Try again. Make sure you understand.

Rob Barnett [00:04:17]:
Then you can move on to my next video, my next set of group work. So, yeah, that's that's a modern classroom. The digital direct instruction, the teacher working closely with the students, and students achieving mastery before they move on.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:04:29]:
Okay. So forgive my ignorance, but it sounds very similar to a flipped classroom model. Is that similar to what the modern classroom looks like?

Rob Barnett [00:04:38]:
No. It's it's not ignorance at all. You're well informed. Yes. I think it is like a flipped classroom with a couple key differences. The first is that there's no assumption that students need to watch anything at home. Where I taught in DC public schools, students didn't always have access to the Internet or computers at home, so they could watch in class. I think the more important distinction is in the flipped classroom, usually every student is working on the same lesson at the same time.

Rob Barnett [00:05:07]:
And I think that's really difficult for students. Because if you missed Monday Tuesday's lesson because you're absent, you come in on Wednesday, you're gonna be lost. And so especially if you can't watch at home. So in a modern classroom, learning is self paced. Different students in the same classroom may be at different lessons, And that's just what you understand determines what you learn next. So I think that's like a flipped classroom, but it's maybe an evolution on on the flipped classroom.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:05:34]:
Got you. Okay. So where are the videos housed? Is this because it sounds like there's an opportunity for on demand videos as well. Is this a YouTube platform that we're utilizing?

Rob Barnett [00:05:43]:
Great question. Our we have there's a couple platforms that we recommend for teachers. Oftentimes, the school will provide a recording platform. Sometimes teachers don't have a recording platform. We say, start a Zoom call with yourself, hit the record button, explain something, pause, stop the recording. There's your video. It's not a super high-tech thing to to record a video. So you use what you have, you make the video, and then if you have some kind of learning management system, you can just put your videos there.

Rob Barnett [00:06:12]:
So I used Canvas. I used Google Classroom at a different school. Now at modern classrooms, we have courses in a in a platform called Moodle. Whatever tools you have or learning management system you have, you can do this. If you can start a video call, you can record a video. Keep it simple and make it accessible to the students so that they can watch it and learn from it. You can spend your time in class sitting down with them and and supporting them.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:06:37]:
This is great. I I actually think this is a good good I guess I have some quest well, I I do have questions, but it it sounds like a really good strategy, a good model that, again, is very modern, especially with health technology. And and as we're looking at artificial intelligence and all the different activities that are are available and resources that are available. So for those who might be like, oh, I'm camera shy. Oh, I'm not as tech savvy. What are some of your thoughts or responses?

Rob Barnett [00:07:04]:
Yeah. I mean, we get that all the time. It's funny. I actually think modern classrooms is sort of like the low tech blended instruction piece because what we really recommend is create your video is a small thing. It just replaces your direct instruction that you might otherwise give from the room. And after that, my students were on paper, like, all class. They watched my video. They took notes on paper.

Rob Barnett [00:07:28]:
They did practice problems on paper. They discussed things face to face. Their mastery checks were on paper. It's not really a high-tech classroom, except for replacing that that piece that I found was ineffective, which was my lecture direct instruction with a video. So it's I love when I see teachers using AI and online practice and all these platforms. There's so much out there. But really the modern classroom is not about fancy tech tools, it's just about delivering instruction in a way that meets learners' needs, and that doesn't have to be fancy. For teachers who are camera shy, you don't have to have your face on camera.

Rob Barnett [00:08:06]:
It doesn't have to be a video setup. You can start a Zoom call. You share your screen. You can hide your camera. You just explain something the same way you'd explain it in class, maybe using some slides. You have a video, except now your students can watch it whenever they're ready. They can pause to ask you a question 1 on 1. They don't have to interrupt the class or risk asking a question that they fear will be a stupid question.

Rob Barnett [00:08:29]:
They can watch it at home. They can watch it in school. Their family can watch it with them if their family wants to get to know you or support the student, and you never have to repeat yourself. I mean, when you're a teacher, you repeat yourself all the time. You have it on video. You say, hey. Go back and watch my video. When you have a question, let's sit down.

Rob Barnett [00:08:48]:
Let's talk about it. By the way, how are you today? What's new in your life? I never had time for that kind of interaction when I was standing at the board trying to deliver a lesson.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:08:56]:
Okay. Okay. Alright. One more question about this, and then I wanna get into the single lesson piece. About how long are the videos on I know it depends on that, but just give us what kinda like a ballpark as far as length of videos.

Rob Barnett [00:09:11]:
Yeah. We're always recommending 5 or 6 minutes. And when teachers say they wanna do longer videos, what we say is just break it up into a couple short videos. I know me. When I see a video on YouTube, if I see it as longer than 10 minutes, I almost don't wanna watch it. I wanna see something that's short, that's concise, and that helps the teacher to be really focused. Sometimes I felt like when I was standing at the board, I had something simple to explain, but I started explaining it, and then I had to go down a different path because some students were missing a prerequisite skill, and then students came in late. They interrupted me.

Rob Barnett [00:09:43]:
I had to control behavior. Before I knew it, 20 minutes of class had gone by. On the video, I would just tell myself, look. You got 5 minutes to explain this. Be super focused. You could do the next skill in the next video. And that's good for students too. It means they don't spend that much time in class watching videos.

Rob Barnett [00:10:00]:
It means they watch the video, they take the notes, and then they go find a friend, and they work together to apply what they've learned.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:10:05]:
Alright. Let's move thank you. So let's let's move into the single class the single lesson because that was something that really sparked my interest because it's, again, thinking from from an equitable lens, how do we give one lesson and make sure that it's equitable to all learners?

Rob Barnett [00:10:22]:
Yeah. Great question. I mean, that's what that's what modern classroom, I think, provides, a single lesson that meets every learner's needs. And I think the the real key here is that not every learner gets that lesson at the same time. Some learners who are advanced, they're gonna race through it. They're gonna reach mastery. They're gonna move on to the next lesson. Some students might take 2 days to understand it, but by the end of those 2 days, they will actually be able to understand it.

Rob Barnett [00:10:51]:
They'll have the support. You'll hold them to a standard of mastery, and you'll make sure that they actually develop understanding. And so every student gets the same content and can achieve the same level of success. What's different is the amount of time that they receive to understand it. Before I started using this modern classroom approach, when I thought about differentiation, I was giving some students harder problems and some students easier problems. Mhmm. I was sort of differentiating in terms of content, and what that meant is my advanced students always got harder content. Their skills got better.

Rob Barnett [00:11:24]:
My struggling students always got easier problems. They just got farther and farther behind. What I realized is I don't wanna differentiate in terms of the level of content. I just wanna differentiate in terms of how much time students have because we know different people learn at different speeds. If you and I were given something new to learn today, it doesn't matter what it is. You might learn it faster than you. It's inevitable. That's a part of being human.

Rob Barnett [00:11:47]:
And so the modern classroom just gives students the time they need to really understand things.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:11:52]:
This is great. Okay. So again, folks, you gotta grab the book, and I'm assuming that's talked about throughout. But it it makes a lot of sense how one lesson, like you said, is yeah. Everybody's getting the same lesson, but they're they're watching or they're spending time on that lesson at different bearing length. Are there some accessibility pieces that you put into those lessons for maybe some of our special ed or 504 students?

Rob Barnett [00:12:20]:
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, one thing that you can do that's really easy and a lot of video platforms make possible now is you can create captions of your videos so students can read them. Actually, now with AI, some platforms will automatically translate your captions. So a student who's not a native English speaker can see the captions in their own languages. That's one thing you can do to make this more accessible. I actually had a co teacher who was a special education certified teacher, and he loved this model because it wasn't like I'm standing at the board and he's in the back of the room wondering how he can support the students whose IEPs he managed. He was sitting down with the students who were on his caseload.

Rob Barnett [00:13:02]:
He was really giving them the support they needed. It was we were both sort of teaching in parallel working together. And so I think when modern classroom teachers have students with those unique needs, they feel like these learners can be supported. And if this student leaves class and goes to a resource room later in the day, that resource room teacher can watch my videos, understand exactly how I'm teaching it, understand the content, and reinforce that. In the resource room, That can happen at home from parents, from siblings, from guardians. So I do think that making your direct instruction digital also makes it more accessible.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:13:39]:
Okay. Yeah. I agree. I agree. Okay. So walk us through let's say a teacher is considering going this direction. They wanna say, what Rob is saying makes a lot of sense. I I and whether whatever your tech level is, but hey, it makes sense.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:13:55]:
I want to transition into videos. The question that I have as I was been listening to you, Rob, was students are gonna watch these videos, but they may move at their own pace. So does that mean as a teacher, I need to create like 10 videos ahead of time? So that way, if a student is a little bit quicker, they can go through the next one and there's or so they're not sitting there waiting for the teacher to produce more videos. How does all that work with the pacing and how often those videos need to be created?

Rob Barnett [00:14:24]:
I think oftentimes teachers hear about this modern classroom and they think, wow. I get the theory. It sounds cool. This is gonna be so much work. I gotta have all these videos. I gotta change the way I teach. And if you think about doing this for the entire year, yes, it's a lot of work. So is teaching traditional.

Rob Barnett [00:14:41]:
Think about standing up there and lecturing every day. Like, that's a lot of work too. And so part of why I wrote the book was to help break this down into simple steps that a teacher can take. Just start with one lesson. One day, you may have 200 videos for all of your lessons if you teach multiple preps. You'll get there. You just gotta start with a single lesson, and I think there's a couple really simple steps you can take to get started. The first is make one video, and I think I said this earlier, but if you can join a video call, you can record a video.

Rob Barnett [00:15:14]:
Start a call with yourself, walk through a slideshow, 5 slides, keep it really simple, stop the recording, and share that with your students. Now you've taken your lesson, same lesson you would give except now it's online, so your students can watch it anywhere and you can spend class time sitting down with them. After students watch the video, they probably need to practice. So in math, I would give 1 or 2 examples of a kind of a new skill. I give my students a page of practice problems. I'd say find a friend, work on this together. And then I'd have a mastery check, which is a check, do you understand this skill? If you do, you advance. If not, you gotta go back.

Rob Barnett [00:15:53]:
You gotta practice more. You gotta talk with me so we can clarify your misconceptions so you're set up for success the second time. And that's really all the lesson needs, some kind of direct instruction, a video, some practice for students to do a mastery check. If you're an English teacher, this might look a little different, but whatever you'd explain from the board is your video. Then students might go read a novel or practice writing topic sentences or something. They'll complete a mastery check. You determine they move on or they don't. And it yes.

Rob Barnett [00:16:24]:
The first time you record a video, you're gonna have some tech challenge. It's not gonna go exactly how you want. You won't like the sound of your voice. All those things are natural, but you don't need to I'm always telling teachers, don't worry about this over the course of a year. Just do it once. Do it twice. Do it three times. If you like the the feel of sitting down with your students in class while they watch on video, if you like it when a student who was absent yesterday can come in and get right to work instead of needing to be caught up, keep going.

Rob Barnett [00:16:53]:
If you don't like it, doesn't bother me, don't do it. If what you're if if what you're doing right now is really working to meet all of your learners' needs, keep you don't need anything I have to share. But I think if you feel like some students are bored or some students are lost or some students are absent and and struggling for that reason, one way you could meet their needs is with a modern classroom lesson. A video practice, a mastery check. That's it. And you'll build more over time.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:17:18]:
You'll build over time. So then the next question then that I have is how often are you revisiting these videos? Are they you said over 200 a bank of 200 videos. Are those videos that are 3, 4 or 5 years old? Or do you revamp your videos, especially with technology getting better or maybe you get more comfortable? I remember some of my early on episodes. I'm on like episode 300, almost 400 at this point. So I remember episode 10 and episode 11. Like I was just getting going and I'm still trying to figure out things. So how often do we revisit these videos that we create?

Rob Barnett [00:17:56]:
My cofounder said something very early in modern classrooms projects existence, which I love. He said, blended learning doesn't need to be pretty. It needs to be personal. And so I actually think those old videos where there's glitches and I make a mistake, students like that. That makes you relatable. When students watch a fancy video of someone else, they might not relate to it. If it's if it's you and you make a mistake or your handwriting's hard to read or something, that's okay. What matters is that you are making the effort to connect with the student and explain something through video.

Rob Barnett [00:18:32]:
Something else I would say, by the way, is you don't have to record your own videos. I recorded mine. A lot of teachers I know, thousands of modern classroom educators create their own videos, but other people like using videos that already exist online. That's totally fine, too. If that works for your students, do it. I think what matters is that if your students can learn from a video, you can spend your time in class connecting with the young person, getting to know them, building the relationship, motivating them, being there when they have questions or something's going on in their life. You can be there for them, not standing at the board lecturing. So if there are good videos in your content area and you your students like them, go for it and use those.

Rob Barnett [00:19:15]:
Use a mix of your videos and those other videos. I think sometimes teachers get worried about this this video piece. And part of the reason for writing the book is just to make it feel a little less intimidating. You make a video, it has mistakes. So what? You make mistakes when you're lecturing from the board too. I mean, that's that's that's what makes you human. We're all human. You don't feel well one day, you don't wanna make a video, you go on YouTube, you find a good video, you give your students the YouTube video and say, hey, watch this explanation.

Rob Barnett [00:19:45]:
I'm gonna be here to answer your questions. I'm gonna be here to support you. All of that is is good. I think you don't need to worry too much about the quality of your videos. And I bet if I I bet if I went back and listened to your early podcast, I might find it charming.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:19:58]:
It's not an invitation, folks. So go back to the episode earlier. All I'm saying is I have gotten a lot more comfortable being on camera, being on the microphone than I did 5 years ago. What I'm hearing from you, Rob, is don't worry about how it looks. Just make sure it's the content there that is gonna help the students engage and learn. So that way, like you said, you can spend the time in the classroom helping maybe small group, 1 on 1, whatever it might need to happen to build those relationships and also ensure that students are mastering the the content.

Rob Barnett [00:20:38]:
That's exactly right. And if you had said a few years ago when you started the podcast on episode 10, oh, this isn't perfect. I give up. You wouldn't have reached the point where you are now, where you feel really comfortable in front of the microphone. I listen to your podcast. I think they're great. You you get better at anything, but over time and with practice, and teaching in this way is exactly like that. But I like to say you can't start getting better until you get started.

Rob Barnett [00:21:05]:
And so in the book, I've really tried to say, give this a shot. You got a unit that starts next week or next month. Just try a couple lessons that are like this. If your students hate it and you and you hate it, then you learn some new skills and you're back to what you were doing. You may find thousands of teachers all over the world have found, hey, when I teach like this, I have a better time in class, my students have a better time in class, let's keep going, and everyone gets more comfortable.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:21:34]:
Alright. I'm gonna shift gears a little bit because I don't wanna misunderstand what I'm hearing because it sounds like a lot of this is individualized for the student, for a student. I'm thinking about teachers that are on the project based side. So maybe collaborative, cooperative learning, project based learning, those kind of place based learning, all of those things. So I'm curious, how do we incorporate a modern classroom for small group project based more of those larger settings instead of and then so it's not just I don't want folks to think that this is just limited to that individualized instructional piece.

Rob Barnett [00:22:08]:
No. I love the question. And I think actually, I part of the reason I started teaching this way is because I wanted to do rich projects with my students. I found it really difficult to do project based learning when students had to move through stages of the project at the same time. Because I'd say, if I said today is part 1 and tomorrow's part 2 and next day is part 3, well, what if a student didn't finish part 1? Do they start on part 2? What if a student was absent? What about the student who finishes part 1 and part 2 right away and then gets bored because they're not being pushed? I think project based learning, inquiry based learning, they are by definition to do them well, you kind of have to be self paced. And one thing that facilitates self paced learning is having instruction recorded on a video. If you're a project based learning teacher, think about if you never had to stand in front of the room and give your students explanations. They could just watch your explanations on a video, and you could spend your time answering questions, giving feedback in class, pushing the students who need a challenge, supporting the students who need help, catching up to students who were absent yesterday or or who came in late today.

Rob Barnett [00:23:22]:
I actually think this fits better with project based learning, inquiry based learning than it does with with the traditional kind of instruction. I think there is a conception, a misconception that computers equals individualized siloed, boring, dull learning, and they can. If you just stick students in an online course and say learn, that's gonna be dull. What we're saying in modern classrooms is place your lecture with a video, have your students on the screen for 10 minutes, then get them working together on practice or a project or something more exciting. It's just when you need to explain something to your students, it's a lot more efficient to do that, I find, through a video than by repeating yourself over and over in class when some students are getting bored, some are behind the loss, some are absent. I hope that makes sense.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:24:15]:
Yeah. Yeah. It makes a great a lot of sense. And that was I just wanted to make sure that my my project folks didn't just tune off. This is not for us. This is something but I think you did a really good job explaining how the benefits can extend beyond just your traditional mindset of what school looks like, whereas often individualized based. But there's opportunities for project based and inquiry based learning as well.

Rob Barnett [00:24:46]:
Yeah. And I think this is this is how I learned things too. The other I mean, last month, my bike needed a little bit of maintenance. So, like, I'm not gonna sign up for a bike maintenance course. I don't have time for that. I'm going on YouTube, looking at some videos, trying to figure it out myself. Then I went to the bike shop and I said, hey. Did I do this? It's kind of like my mastery check.

Rob Barnett [00:25:06]:
Unfortunately, they said, no. You didn't fix the brakes. Like, here's how to fix it. So but but that's that's how learning, I think, happens in the most authentic way, at least for adults in the modern world. And I think we should have students learning like that too. Access your resource, which in my case is a video. Try to teach yourself. Ask me for questions.

Rob Barnett [00:25:28]:
Ask your colleagues for questions. Come to me. Show me you understand it, and I'll help you move on or I'll help you build your understanding. That's what real learning is like.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:25:37]:
Love this. Alright. Well, Rob, I have learned a lot in in in regards to modern classroom. Where how did you come about this? Like, is this a concept that you created or is is this something that someone's work that you kinda came across? How did this get established, I guess?

Rob Barnett [00:25:54]:
It's a great question. And that's part of the reason I wrote the book is I really wanted to sort of tell this story. I mean, I I think of the book as a little bit my story of how I got here, but more importantly, using my story to explain how the model works and how any teacher can do it because I was a regular teacher like anyone else. I just decided to do something different. And where I've landed is this model that we now call modern classrooms. I'm far from the 1st teacher to do this. People have been trying to individualize learning since the days of the one room schoolhouse. In some way, the one room schoolhouse is actually the original modern classroom.

Rob Barnett [00:26:32]:
If you think about students moving at their own pace based on what they understand. In terms of things like videos and learning management systems, I was really lucky because early in my teaching career, I met people who showed me how to do certain things that I didn't know how to do. There was another math teacher in my district named Nick Bennett. I talk about him in the book. I went to one of those district wide PD sessions, and I found myself in a workshop he offered. And he said, here's how I create videos, and it it blew my mind. I went home that night, and I started working on doing videos because it just opened up the potential for me. My my cofounder, Kareem Farah, I ended up showing him this model.

Rob Barnett [00:27:13]:
He took it on. He's so, so good at developing relationships with young people. And when I saw the way that he sat down with his students and took the time to get to know them, I I borrowed a lot of that because I was just so impressed by how he was with his students. And so I've taken practices that I've seen are effective elsewhere and put them together in all in one place for teachers. I think that's really the value of modern classrooms and of the book is taking these evidence based practices, putting them in a simple framework that any teacher can use. And I hope I hope your listeners will feel motivated to give it a try.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:27:48]:
Your story sounds very interesting. And and I'd love for our audience to get, as they're listening to this, to if you can give them one final word of advice to our listeners. I

Rob Barnett [00:27:58]:
would say to listeners, just give this approach a try. Take an hour to learn about it. You can look at my book or you can go to the Modern Classrooms Project website. It's learn.modernclassrooms.org. We have a free course that gives a lot of examples of this model in action and has tons of resources for you too. So if you prefer an online course to a book, you can visit our free online course. Take an hour to learn about it. Take an hour or 2 to try creating this kind of lesson with a video, with practice, with a mastery check, and give it to your students and see how it goes.

Rob Barnett [00:28:36]:
I think you may discover that it doesn't work for you. And if that's your judgment, then from from an educator to an educator, I trust you. Don't do anything that doesn't work. But you may find that, hey. This works for my students. I feel like I can sit down with my students in class. I can get to know them. I can support them.

Rob Barnett [00:28:55]:
I can challenge them. And you just can't know that until you try. So take a few simple steps, a video practice, mastery check, give them to your students, see how it goes. And one day you may be writing a book about your experience too.

Dr. Sheldon Eakins [00:29:11]:
Alright. Well, again, links in the show notes, folks. Rob, it has truly been a pleasure. Thank you so much for your time.

Rob Barnett [00:29:16]:
Thank you. It's an honor for me to be here and and share this with your listeners.

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